Canada’s ‘Atlantic Loop’ power grid could bring big value to Maine

Maine should get in on the planning early as the 4 Atlantic provinces and Quebec weigh a grand proposal for clean energy.

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Comment by Robert Feller on October 1, 2020 at 2:18pm

Sweet mother of pearl: anything coming out of the mouth of that left wing identity politics certifiably loony Trudeau should make you run [not walk] the opposite direction.  Any 3rd grade student knows that solar won't work at night and wind only works when it's windy so for every watt of "green" energy there has to be the same reliable fossil fuel fired electrical generation.  While hydro may have consistency that wind and solar don't have, it is invasive to run the lines to transmit that power long distances.  Without federal subsidies [YOUR tax dollars] neither wind or solar make any sense and without further federal subsidy the extended transmission lines are not feasible either. 

We are being forced through these government subsidies [giveaways] to participate whether we believe in solar & wind or not.  The proposed transmission corridor will undoubtedly have cost overruns into the 100's of millions and at some point we as citizens have to draw the line in the sand and say "No More!"

Adam Smith wrote "Wealth of Nations" and set the stage for the study of economics, something the solar and wind proponents need to read.  Until we the citizens decide to eliminate government subsidies that offset the marketplace we will all continue to be the victims of whatever politician thanks will get them reelected; damned the taxpayers footing the bill.

Comment by Willem Post on September 30, 2020 at 12:08am
Art,
Wind and solar have UPSTREAM CO2 emissions, from mines and oil wells, to manufacturing, to erecting on a ridgeline in Maine.
All that happens before a single kWh is generated.
1) Wind and solar also DISTURB the grid (DUCK-curves), which requires OTHER, TRADITIONAL generators to make variations in their output to counteract the variable wind and solar. That does not come for free.
2) Widely dispersed wind and solar require much more grid augmentation/extension than traditional plants.
That does not come for free.
3) Wind and solar require subsidies to enable New England owners to sell to utilities at 9.5 - 10 c/kWh for wind, and 11 c/kWh for LARGE solar.
Owners prices would need to be at least 45% higher, if there were no subsidies, write-offs, and deducting of interest on borrowed money 
4) After about 20 to 25 years much of the wind turbine needs to be replaced.
The same is true for toxic solar panels
That means large quantities of materials have to be recycled/landfilled which emit CO2. 
That will become a BIG BUSINESS FOR MANY DECADES.
5) Very often there is MINIMAL WIND and MINIMAL Solar in New England
Such lulls are up to 5 - 7 days long, and they happen THROUGHOUT THE YEAR, per weather data, and ISO-NE real-time, minute-by-minute, wind and solar production.
What would supply the missing kWh to serve demand?
Would that be the traditional generators RE folks are so eager to shut down, as was done in California?
Would all of us be using wax candles and oil lamps, like the good old days?
Would we have expensive batteries to cover such lulls and SEASONAL VARIATIONS, that would increase the price of any electricity passing through them by at least 15 - 20 c/kWh, and would have a useful life of about 15 years?
Comment by Art Brigades on September 29, 2020 at 11:36am

Mr. Post, you said:

That electricity has CO2 emissions of less 10 g/kWh, which is much less than the 276 g/kWh, primary energy basis, or 304 g/kWh, source energy basis, of the NE grid. That electricity has MUCH LESS Co2 than wind and solar/kWh

Given the controversy fabricated by NRCM and others regarding the NECEC power line (they shriek that it doesn't reduce CO2), it would be informative if you could further discuss, particularly how wind and solar are CO2 emitters.

Comment by Willem Post on September 29, 2020 at 10:19am

The Atlantic Loop would benefit the four Atlantic Canada provinces and Quebec, AND MAINE, AND ALL OF NEW ENGLAND, because it would provide a great infusion of LOW COST electricity into Maine and New England.

The price of Hydro Quebec Grid hydro electricity is about 5.7 c/kWh, delivered to the US BORDER

That electricity has CO2 emissions of less 10 g/kWh, which is much less than the 276 g/kWh, primary energy basis, or 304 g/kWh, source energy basis, of the NE grid.

That electricity has MUCH LESS Co2 than wind and solar/kWh

Table 1/Vermont & NE sources

Total

Grid support

Subsidies

Paid to

GMP

 Cost to

cost

cost

to owner

owner

adder

rate base

c/kWh

c/kWh

c/kWh

c/kWh

c/kWh

c/kWh

Solar, residential rooftop, net-metered

25.5

2.1

5.4

18.0

3.8

21.8

Solar, com’l/ind’l, legacy, standard offer

34.4

2.1

10.5

21.8

?

21.8

Solar, com’l/ind’l, new, standard offer*

23.5

2.1

9.6

11.8

?

11.8

Wind, ridge line, new*

18.8

2.4

7.4

9.0

?

9.0

.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Lifetime Cost of Electricity, LCOE

Gas, combined cycle, existing

4 - 5

Gas, combined cycle, new

5 - 6

Gas, open cycle, peaking, existing

9 - 10

Gas, open cycle, peaking, new

 

 

 

18 - 20

 

 

Nuclear, existing

4.0

Nuclear, new, 60-plus-y life

7.5

Coal, existing

4.0

Coal, new

7.5

Hydro, existing

4.0

Hydro Vermont, net-metered, new

10.0

Wood burning Vermont, net-metered, existing

10.0

* Competitive bidding lowered prices paid to owners.

 

* Owner prices to utilities are based on recent 20-year electricity supply contracts awarded by competitive bidding in New England. These prices would have been about 48% to 50% higher without the direct and indirect subsidies and the cost shifting.

http://www.windtaskforce.org/profiles/blogs/cost-shifting-is-the-na...

Hannah Pingree on the Maine expedited wind law

Hannah Pingree - Director of Maine's Office of Innovation and the Future

"Once the committee passed the wind energy bill on to the full House and Senate, lawmakers there didn’t even debate it. They passed it unanimously and with no discussion. House Majority Leader Hannah Pingree, a Democrat from North Haven, says legislators probably didn’t know how many turbines would be constructed in Maine."

https://pinetreewatch.org/wind-power-bandwagon-hits-bumps-in-the-road-3/

 

Maine as Third World Country:

CMP Transmission Rate Skyrockets 19.6% Due to Wind Power

 

Click here to read how the Maine ratepayer has been sold down the river by the Angus King cabal.

Maine Center For Public Interest Reporting – Three Part Series: A CRITICAL LOOK AT MAINE’S WIND ACT

******** IF LINKS BELOW DON'T WORK, GOOGLE THEM*********

(excerpts) From Part 1 – On Maine’s Wind Law “Once the committee passed the wind energy bill on to the full House and Senate, lawmakers there didn’t even debate it. They passed it unanimously and with no discussion. House Majority Leader Hannah Pingree, a Democrat from North Haven, says legislators probably didn’t know how many turbines would be constructed in Maine if the law’s goals were met." . – Maine Center for Public Interest Reporting, August 2010 https://www.pinetreewatchdog.org/wind-power-bandwagon-hits-bumps-in-the-road-3/From Part 2 – On Wind and Oil Yet using wind energy doesn’t lower dependence on imported foreign oil. That’s because the majority of imported oil in Maine is used for heating and transportation. And switching our dependence from foreign oil to Maine-produced electricity isn’t likely to happen very soon, says Bartlett. “Right now, people can’t switch to electric cars and heating – if they did, we’d be in trouble.” So was one of the fundamental premises of the task force false, or at least misleading?" https://www.pinetreewatchdog.org/wind-swept-task-force-set-the-rules/From Part 3 – On Wind-Required New Transmission Lines Finally, the building of enormous, high-voltage transmission lines that the regional electricity system operator says are required to move substantial amounts of wind power to markets south of Maine was never even discussed by the task force – an omission that Mills said will come to haunt the state.“If you try to put 2,500 or 3,000 megawatts in northern or eastern Maine – oh, my god, try to build the transmission!” said Mills. “It’s not just the towers, it’s the lines – that’s when I begin to think that the goal is a little farfetched.” https://www.pinetreewatchdog.org/flaws-in-bill-like-skating-with-dull-skates/

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