Comments - ELECTRIC TRANSIT AND SCHOOL BUS SYSTEMS REDUCE LITTLE CO2, ARE NOT COST-EFFECTIVE - Citizens' Task Force on Wind Power - Maine2024-03-29T11:56:02Zhttps://www.windtaskforce.org/profiles/comment/feed?attachedTo=4401701%3ABlogPost%3A211443&xn_auth=noBOB,
A river of money to achi…tag:www.windtaskforce.org,2021-08-13:4401701:Comment:2218412021-08-13T10:06:14.203ZWillem Posthttps://www.windtaskforce.org/profile/WillemPost942
<p>BOB,</p>
<p>A river of money to achieve next to NOTHING regarding GLOBAL WARMING?</p>
<p></p>
<p>The only thing it will achieve is more feel-good ECO-egoism of Dem/Prog RE folks, yearning for lucrative RE careers, and more and more CENTRALIZED command/control of the Vermont economy.</p>
<p></p>
<p>They will want more and more money, because their goals are EPHEMERAL, ELUSIVE FATA MORGANAs, akin to tilting at windmills, while wishing water would flow uphill.…</p>
<p></p>
<p>BOB,</p>
<p>A river of money to achieve next to NOTHING regarding GLOBAL WARMING?</p>
<p></p>
<p>The only thing it will achieve is more feel-good ECO-egoism of Dem/Prog RE folks, yearning for lucrative RE careers, and more and more CENTRALIZED command/control of the Vermont economy.</p>
<p></p>
<p>They will want more and more money, because their goals are EPHEMERAL, ELUSIVE FATA MORGANAs, akin to tilting at windmills, while wishing water would flow uphill.</p>
<p><a rel="nofollow noopener" href="http://www.truenorthreports.com/roper-vermont-climate-council-wants-a-river-of-money" target="_blank">http://www.truenorthreports.com/roper-vermont-climate-council-wants...</a></p>
<p></p>
<p>The turnkey capital cost to implement the Vermont Comprehensive Energy Plan, CEP, would be in excess of $1.0 billion/y for at least 33 years (2017 - 2050), according to a 2015 Energy Action Network, EAN, annual report. If updated to 2021, the numbers would be about $1.25 billion/y for 29 years (2021 - 2050). See URLs.</p>
<p><br/><br/><a rel="nofollow noopener" href="http://eanvt.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/EAN-2015-Annual-Report-Low-Res-Final.pdf" target="_blank">http://eanvt.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/EAN-2015-Annual-Report-...</a> <br/><a rel="nofollow noopener" href="https://outside.vermont.gov/sov/webservices/Shared%20Documents/2016CEP_Final.pdf" target="_blank">https://outside.vermont.gov/sov/webservices/Shared%20Documents/2016...</a><br/><a rel="nofollow noopener" href="https://www.windtaskforce.org/profiles/blogs/high-costs-of-wind-solar-and-battery-systems" target="_blank">https://www.windtaskforce.org/profiles/blogs/high-costs-of-wind-sol...</a></p>
<p></p>
<p>Spending on government energy programs, including Efficiency Vermont, has averaged about $210 million/y from 2000 to 2015, a total of at least $2.5 billion, but Vermont CO2 emissions increased from 9.64 million metric ton in 2000, to 9.54 MMt in 2015, a decrease of 1.0%. <br/>See page 36 of URL<br/><a rel="nofollow noopener" href="https://dec.vermont.gov/sites/dec/files/aqc/climate-change/documents/_Vermont_Greenhouse_Gas_Emissions_Inventory_Update_1990-2017_Final.pdf" target="_blank">https://dec.vermont.gov/sites/dec/files/aqc/climate-change/document...</a></p>
<p></p>
<p>EVs</p>
<p>EAN, with help of VT-DPS, claimed, without providing any calculations, a CO2 reduction more than two times as great, i.e., 4.5 versus 2.180 Mt/y per EV; the reduction would be even less, if the A-to-Z CO2 and lifetime conditions had not been ignored</p>
<p><br/><br/>This excessive 4.5 Mt/y claim was made to deceive people, including legislators, and to hype the adoption of overly expensive, not-very-useful EVs.<br/>See table 1 and 2 in URL<br/><a rel="nofollow noopener" href="https://www.windtaskforce.org/profiles/blogs/some-ne-state-governments-play-deceptive-games-with-co2-emissions" target="_blank">https://www.windtaskforce.org/profiles/blogs/some-ne-state-governme...</a></p>
<p></p>
<p>HEAT PUMPS</p>
<p>EAN, with help of VT-DPS, claimed, without providing any calculations, 90,000 HPs would reduce CO2 by 0.370 million Mt/y, or 4.111 Mt/y per HP<br/>See page 4 of URL<br/><a rel="nofollow noopener" href="https://www.eanvt.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/EAN-report-2020-final.pdf" target="_blank">https://www.eanvt.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/EAN-report-2020-fi...</a></p>
<p></p>
<p>Heat pumps displaced only 35% of my space heating propane in my well-insulated/well-sealed house.<br/>This is better than the AVERAGE displacement of 27.6% by HPs in AVERAGE Vermont houses, per VT-DPS study. See URL<br/><a rel="nofollow noopener" href="https://publicservice.vermont.gov/sites/dps/files/documents/2017%20Evaluation%20of%20Cold%20Climate%20Heat%20Pumps%20in%20Vermont.pdf" target="_blank">https://publicservice.vermont.gov/sites/dps/files/documents/2017%20...</a></p>
<p></p>
<p>The CO2 reduction of my displaced propane was 300 gal x 12.7 lb CO2/gal = 1.728 Mt/y, and the CO2 of the additional electricity was 2332 x 317 g/kWh = 0.739 Mt/y, for a reduction of 0.989 Mt/y, based on the ISO-NE value of 317 g/kWh, using fuel consumption of all power plants connected to the NE grid.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Heat Pumps are Money Losers in my Vermont House (as they are in almost all people's houses)</p>
<p>I installed three Mitsubishi, 24,000 Btu/h HPs, Model MXZ-2C24NAHZ2, each with 2 heads; 2 in the living room, 1 in the kitchen, and 1 in each of 3 bedrooms. The HPs have DC variable-speed, motor-driven compressors and fans, which improves the efficiency of low-temperature operation. The HPs last about 15 years. Turnkey capital cost was $24,000</p>
<p></p>
<p>I do not operate my HPs at 10F or below, because HPs would become increasingly less efficient with decreasing temperatures. <br/>The HP operating cost per hour would become greater than of my highly efficient propane furnace. See URL <br/><a rel="nofollow noopener" href="http://www.windtaskforce.org/profiles/blogs/vermont-co2-reduction-of-ashps-is-based-on-misrepresentations" target="_blank">http://www.windtaskforce.org/profiles/blogs/vermont-co2-reduction-o...</a></p>
<p></p>
<p>The cost of displaced propane was 300 x $2.399/gal = $720/y <br/>The cost of additional electricity for HPs was 2332 x 0.20 = $466/y<br/>My energy cost savings due to the HPs were $253/y, on an investment of $24,000!!<br/>If all my investments had been this great, I would be in a poorhouse, and on welfare.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Cost of CO2 Reduction was (2,059, amortizing - 253, energy cost saving + 200, parts and maintenance)/0.998 Mt/y, CO2 reduction, table 6 = $2028/Mt, which is similar to money-losing, very expensive, electric transit and school buses. See URL<br/><a rel="nofollow noopener" href="https://www.windtaskforce.org/profiles/blogs/electric-bus-systems-likely-not-cost-effective-in-vermont-at" target="_blank">https://www.windtaskforce.org/profiles/blogs/electric-bus-systems-l...</a></p>
<p></p>
<p>Weatherizing Vermont's energy-hog houses at $10,000 each would NOT render these house suitable for HPs, BY A LONG SHOT, as was proven in MY housed and by the VT-DPS study</p>
<p></p>
<p>Only high-efficiency houses that are HIGHLY SEALED AND HIGHLY INSULATED are suitable for HPs.</p>
<p></p>
<p>All of the above has been well known to VT-DPS and EAN, because I have kept them, and thousands of others, informed over the years.</p> Ken,
RE folks talking about “…tag:www.windtaskforce.org,2021-05-28:4401701:Comment:2182142021-05-28T19:34:50.577ZWillem Posthttps://www.windtaskforce.org/profile/WillemPost942
<p>Ken,</p>
<p>RE folks talking about “improved” compared to 1990s are right.</p>
<p>I wrote this article to show how much the improvement has been.</p>
<p>Far greater improvement is needed for “prime time” performance regarding school buses and transit buses, and also regarding EVs, which presently are in the Model T or Model A stage.</p>
<p>The money spent on electric school buses essentially is wasted, i.e., throw away </p>
<p>There are much less costly ways to reduce CO2. See…</p>
<p>Ken,</p>
<p>RE folks talking about “improved” compared to 1990s are right.</p>
<p>I wrote this article to show how much the improvement has been.</p>
<p>Far greater improvement is needed for “prime time” performance regarding school buses and transit buses, and also regarding EVs, which presently are in the Model T or Model A stage.</p>
<p>The money spent on electric school buses essentially is wasted, i.e., throw away </p>
<p>There are much less costly ways to reduce CO2. See article.</p>
<p></p> GPCOG/PACTS has extensive pla…tag:www.windtaskforce.org,2021-02-15:4401701:Comment:2116532021-02-15T16:55:06.185ZKenneth Capronhttps://www.windtaskforce.org/profile/KennethCapron
<p>GPCOG/PACTS has extensive plans for electric buses in their "Transit Tomorrow" plan. Belinda Ray slid in five corridors of BRT or Bus Rapid Transit. They run from the City out Rt302, Rt100/26, Rt1 N+S and Rt22.<br></br><br></br>Having been involved with the testing of electric buses in the 90's, the weren't very efficient. Despite being told that the should have lasted a half day on one set of batteries, we found ourselves have to replace the battery packs every 2.5 hours. Considering that the…</p>
<p>GPCOG/PACTS has extensive plans for electric buses in their "Transit Tomorrow" plan. Belinda Ray slid in five corridors of BRT or Bus Rapid Transit. They run from the City out Rt302, Rt100/26, Rt1 N+S and Rt22.<br/><br/>Having been involved with the testing of electric buses in the 90's, the weren't very efficient. Despite being told that the should have lasted a half day on one set of batteries, we found ourselves have to replace the battery packs every 2.5 hours. Considering that the process to forklift one set out and the other set in was length, the recharge was almost 24 hours.<br/><br/>Now when I ask about the efficiency of electric buses, all I get is "things have improved since the 90's".</p>